The .25 ACP Breech Plug Conversion

   Now available, a .25 ACP brass priming kit.  This kit contains all the tools needed to prime and re-prime your .25 ACP brass.  Click here for details...
Every now and then something new comes along that just has to be shared with fellow shooters.

Here are some emails I received from real folks that have used the Precision Rifle QT muzzleloader bullet:

Deer Ray, The 235 grain QT did its job again. I got this buck with a Winchester Apex .50 caliber using the 25 ACP primer conversion. The conversion has worked very well giving tighter groups when compared to the 209 primers. It also leaves almost no fouling around the firing pin and breech plug. I shot the buck at approximately 40 yards and the deer only went about 30 yards after a clean through lung shot. 

Best regards, Don Greene 

PRAFBP™ "Precision Rifle Accu-Fire Breech Plug" Patent Pending

Above: T/C Omega modified breach plug to use .25 ACP brass cases in place of the 209 primer.

The folks at Precision Rifle have this to say about their reasons for developing an improvement to the Thompson Center Omega.

"Too much flame; too much fouling:
Our TC Encore gets so dirty from the 209 primer that after 50 shots the firing pin will not even travel far enough to ignite the primer. I need to remove the butt stock and clean the entire action with brake clean and compressed air before it will work. Too much flame trying to get through the small hole.

If you check out the cartridge in the foreground of the photo you can see that it is perfectly clean. It has been used 27 times and has not even been wiped off. No fouling, no mess. Look inside the breach plug and action; 50 shots without being touched and not a spot of fouling anywhere.

Too much energy:
I have no idea who started the 209 craze but I believe that it provides way more energy than is required to get the job done. Try this experiment for yourself. Take your ramrod with a jag and a clean damp patch, push it all the way down the barrel of your Thompson Center Encore. Mark the ramrod where it meets the end of the barrel with a strip of masking tape. Put a 209 into the breach plug, close the gun, cock the hammer and pull the trigger. With our TC Encore, the ramrod will get blown 6"- 8" up the barrel with just the force of the 209. If we do the same experiment with our Hornet / Thompson Center Encore breach plug with it's small rifle primer, the ramrod moves less than 1".

We have all but eliminated those unexplained flyers from our TC Encore groups. Personally, I believe these flyers were the result of the 209 actually lifting the sabot off the powder charge simultaneous with igniting the powder. The much milder Small Rifle primer of the Hornet case ignites the powder just as instantly but lacks the energy to move the sabot and bullet off the powder charge therefore eliminating the flyers.

More fine tuning options:
Unlike the 209, Small Rifle sized primers come in a variety of ranges and qualities. One can experiment with Standard, Magnum and Bench Rest to add one more variable to the mix. To this point, we have seen the best success with CCI 400 but that could change with the next load.

To sum up, I love this conversion. The Thompson Center Encore is now perfectly clean inside and out shot after shot. I have eliminated the flyers caused by the excessive 209 energy levels. I find the shortened .22 Hornet cases very easy to install, remove and find in my pockets. One case has been primed over 40 times with the primer pocket fit as snug as it way when we first used it. We decap and prime the cases with the very economical Lee line of reloading equipment. As you loose them, you simply trim down another handful of .22 Hornet brass and away you go.

The .22 Hornet, possibly one of the most enduring cartridges ever designed, lends itself for yet another purpose.

June 20th update:

It's not often that we are granted the luxury of head to head comparisons of one idea versus another idea. Today was one of those rare days.

We headed to the range with a pair of brand new T/C Omega rifles. One in .45 and the other in .50. The .45 was posting groups of 3.5" to 4.0" throughout the entire day with no real pattern being evident. It's owner guessed it might be the bedding or the new scope but was really quite disappointed.

The .50, on the other hand, had a pretty good day. Most everything shot about 1.5" to 2" and it did not seem very fussy. The crowing moment came when I decided to try our 195 gr Dead Center Duplex sabots. Three shots touched at 100 yards and life was wonderful.


The .50 had been fitted with the .22 Hornet breach plug while the .45 was using the factory 209 style. During a short rain delay, I suggested that we take the best combination that we had come across with the .45 and try it again but this time use the .22 Hornet breach plug instead of the 209. It was agreed and the gun was loaded with 100 grains of Triple 7 FFF powder and 195 grain Dead Center bullet. The only change was instead of the 209, we used the shortened .22 Hornet case with a CCI 400 primer. Magic; the group shrunk by 75% to right around 1" at 100 yards. With a little encouragement, the shooter completed a second three shot group which measured just under 1.3" . The best two groups back to back that this Omega had ever shot and the only change was CCI 400 small rifle primer in place of the 209 shotgun primer. The day ended and we not only had a "semi-believer" converted; we also had another breach plug to convert."

Want your breach plug converted for your T/C Encore, Omega, CVA Optima, Kodiak, NEF, G2 (.45 cal only), or Winchester Apex?

It seems that Precision Rifle is not the only shooter interested in improving the the accuracy of their muzzleloaders that use the 209 primer. Their e-mail and telephone lines have lit up since they first posted this page on their website. 

Precision rifle has come up with an even better solution than the .22 hornet conversion. 

After much research and testing, they have come up with .25 ACP T/C Omega & Encore, CVA Optima & Kodiak, and Winchester Apex breech plugs conversions. 

What makes this a better idea is this conversion offers the same accuracy as the .22 hornet conversion, but there is no trimming or fitting involved and they offer the versatility of using either small rifle or pistol primers.

R & P Muzzleloading now offers these (.25 ACP Breech Plug conversion) "Precision Rifle Accu-Fire Breech Plugs" for the T/C Encore, T/C Omega, CVA Optima, CVA Kodiak and Winchester Apex. They are only $59.95 (while they last). Each conversion kit includes a dozen .25 ACP cases and will be shipped by 2-3 day Priority Mail. Order today and have it shipped today (Breech plug shipping is free with bullet order). Please order your breech plug conversion by selecting it from the list below and click.  If you have the new T/C Pro Hunter or your muzzleloader is not listed below click here.

Now available, a .25 ACP brass priming kit.  This kit contains all the tools needed to prime and re-prime your .25 ACP brass.  See details...

Extra .25 ACP brass (no additional shipping cost when ordered with breech plug): 

                $4.95 per  25, $8.95 per 50, or $14.95 per 100

 

25 each .25 ACP Brass     Quantity: 50 each .25 ACP Brass     Quantity: 100 each .25 ACP Brass     Quantity:

PELLETS VS LOOSE POWDER

Most bullets designed to shoot well in a 1 in 28 inch twist barrel will normally do so somewhere between 100 and 120 grains (always measure by volume) of loose Triple 7 powder.  Fact; Triple 7 loose powder is hotter than Pyrodex or regular Triple 7 pellets (this does not include the new Triple 7 Magnum pellets) by about 15%.  That means, shooting 2 of either of these pellets is equivalent to approximately 85 grains of loose Triple 7.  Shooting 3 pellets is equivalent to about 130 grains of loose powder.  This means by using 2 or 3 of the 50-grain pellets you will miss the window for best velocity and accuracy possible, IF your chosen bullet was designed to shoot well in a 1 in 28 twist rifle.

What determines how well a Muzzleloading bullet shoots?  By this, I mean, "What enables it to achieve its best velocity and accuracy?"  I believe it achieves this if it reaches the optimum rate of spin needed to stabilize it in flight (how fast you push the bullet through the barrel and the barrels rate of twist will determine how much spin is put on the bullet).  How does one know when this happens?  Well, I suggest one way to determine this is to start by over spinning the muzzleloader bullet (shooting it with too much powder) and measuring your 3 to 5 shot groups.  Be sure to follow a good in between shot routine or none of this will make any difference; click here to read the steps.  Back off on the powder 5 increments in volume shoot another 3 to 5 shot group.  Your groups will tell you when your muzzleloader bullet has reached its optimum rate of spin.  Normally the higher the ballistic coefficient of your bullet the more spin it will need to stabilize it.  I submit that if your Muzzleloading bullet is designed to shoot its best in a 1 in 28 twist barrel, this will occur somewhere between 100 and 120 grains of loose Triple 7 powder.

If I am correct, and I believe I am, using 2 or 3 of the 50 grain pellets misses the window for your best accuracy completely.

Now some are going to suggest using 2 50-grain and 1 30-grain pellet to fall within the window above.  That might work, but unlike loose powder, it does not allow for a 5 grain more or less powder test for best flight and accuracy.

Here is what Hodgdon's says about loose powder on their website.

• Triple Seven produces the highest velocities of all granular muzzleloading propellants when compared by volume (see Comparison Chart below). An added bonus is that this enhanced velocity results in a flatter trajectory and greater down range energy.
• Triple Seven works with all styles and brands of projectiles which makes it easy to find a load and maintain accuracy.

Enhanced velocity results in a flatter trajectory and greater down range energy... Wait, couldn't you achieve that with 3 50-grain pellets?  Velocity yes, but if you can't hit what you are shooting at...

Easy to find a load and maintain accuracy... Well, now isn't that what we are all striving for.  Why don't they say that about their pellets?  Because they know you can't do it with pellets.  Instead, ease of use is their selling pitch.

I submit that it would be nice if you could have both, but most of the time it just doesn't work out that way.  My assumption is that you are considering a .25 ACP Breech Plug conversion for two reasons; cleanliness and the best velocity and accuracy possible.  Why would you only go half of the way with a cleaner ignition system designed to allow your gun to achieve its best possible accuracy and velocity, by using pellets?  Take the leap to loose powder.  You won't be sorry you did.

Here is a group I shot Saturday, 24 January, 2004 using my T / C Omega with the .22 Hornet conversion. It is a 100 yard group shot using .40 QT 215 grain; 105 grains 777 FFg; I was working up a load for a feral hog hunt in February. I think I am ready.
 

Hi Ray,

This deer I recently took during muzzleloader season using a CVA Kodiak 50. cal inline using your .25 ACP breech plug system.  The bullet was a 245gr.Barnes spitfire. Powder charge was 3 - 50gr Pyrodex pellets.  The shot was 192 yards with the bullet traveling through both lungs and between the ribs. (No Bone contact)  After firing the shot which was over the backs of two does to hit the buck, which was a 8" inch window over the does.  The buck ran 175 yards before falling over dead in a thicket. I was only able to find 3 drops of blood of about the size of the end of a "Q" tip.  Needless to say, tracking was somewhat awful being no snow on the ground. His hoof track is basically all I had to go by.  After 15 minutes of tracking I found the deer piled up in the nearby thicket where I saw him run too.  He bled out entirely inside his chest cavity. The exit wound was exactly the size of the entrance wound (no expansion at all).
Basically like shooting a full metal jacket.  Nice sweet long range with the Barnes spitfire but poor expansion of the bullet. Still an awesome shot for any gun. But I do love the ease of a good blood trail.

As for the .25 ACP system, It rocks!!  At 200 yards and 150gr Pyrodex pellets and bench rested I am placing minus 3"inch groups 6"inches low.  At 125 yards I am 2"inches high cutting bullet for bullet and swabbing with a spit patch on all shots.  Never to return to the 209 system.  Next year I will try another style of bullet. The Barnes tipped MZ with its large hollow point looks like possibility or Hornady's new SST.

Have a nice and Happy new year Ray!

Tom Giesige

PRbullet!

I have enjoyed shooting your bullets, I have purchased 300 of your Dead Center .40 cal 200 grain for my T/C Encore, very nice. I have also shot approx 200 of your QT .40 cal 250 .44 cal. Wonderful expansion on recovered bullets. I am currently working with your .40 250 grain QT, but due to Indiana law I must use a .44 cal bullet. I have now shot 150 rounds through my T/C Encore and 100 rounds with my new Omega. . .  after using your loading and "spit patching" procedure. To say the least I am pleased. Currently the Omega is being zeroed in at 200 yards. Using 130 grains of Triple 7 and attaining 2.0 to 2.5 inch groups. I tell everyone about your product! Thanks for all the good work. Looking forward to your ballistics on the Dead Center 260 grain.

Thanks again!
Todd Wiedell